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Subject: [ActiveDir] Adding extra IP to domain controller
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jw1User is Offline

Posts:0

04/21/2008 11:35 AM  
Will there be any unexpected consequences if I add an extra IP to a domain controller or two? We're replacing most of our domain controllers, but a handful of them are referenced by IP by some dumb applications...and we don't really want to keep the primary IP the same.

I'm guessing there would be extra DNS records for each IP address - will there be any problems as a result?



Thanks,


--James
List info : http://www.activedir.org/List.aspx
List FAQ : http://www.activedir.org/ListFAQ.aspx
List archive: http://www.activedir.org/ma/default.aspx
bdesmondUser is Offline

Posts:415

04/21/2008 11:45 AM  
Should be fine. I'd still work on sunsetting the hardcoded apps though and
at least changing them to use a generic DNS record.

--brian

On Mon, Apr 21, 2008 at 11:30 AM, Wells, James Arthur <jw1@bcm.tmc.edu>
wrote:

> Will there be any unexpected consequences if I add an extra IP to a domain
> controller or two? We're replacing most of our domain controllers, but a
> handful of them are referenced by IP by some dumb applications...and we
> don't really want to keep the primary IP the same.
>
> I'm guessing there would be extra DNS records for each IP address - will
> there be any problems as a result?
>
>
>
> Thanks,
>
>
> --James
> List info : http://www.activedir.org/List.aspx
> List FAQ : http://www.activedir.org/ListFAQ.aspx
> List archive: http://www.activedir.org/ma/default.aspx
>



--
Thanks,
Brian Desmond
brian@briandesmond.com

c - 312.731.3132

jw1User is Offline

Posts:0

04/21/2008 11:50 AM  
Certainly plan to. Just needed a stopgap since hardware is end-of-life...



--James



From: ActiveDir-owner@mail.activedir.org [mailto:ActiveDir-owner@mail.activedir.org] On Behalf Of Brian Desmond
Sent: Monday, April 21, 2008 10:43 AM
To: ActiveDir@mail.activedir.org
Subject: Re: [ActiveDir] Adding extra IP to domain controller



Should be fine. I'd still work on sunsetting the hardcoded apps though and at least changing them to use a generic DNS record.



--brian

On Mon, Apr 21, 2008 at 11:30 AM, Wells, James Arthur <jw1@bcm.tmc.edu> wrote:

Will there be any unexpected consequences if I add an extra IP to a domain controller or two? We're replacing most of our domain controllers, but a handful of them are referenced by IP by some dumb applications...and we don't really want to keep the primary IP the same.

I'm guessing there would be extra DNS records for each IP address - will there be any problems as a result?



Thanks,


--James
List info : http://www.activedir.org/List.aspx
List FAQ : http://www.activedir.org/ListFAQ.aspx
List archive: http://www.activedir.org/ma/default.aspx




--
Thanks,
Brian Desmond
brian@briandesmond.com

c - 312.731.3132


bdesmondUser is Offline

Posts:415

04/21/2008 12:16 PM  
Yeah should be fine unless you've got some app connecting on LDAPS and
validating the name on the certificate if you have new names and the same
IP...

--brian

On Mon, Apr 21, 2008 at 11:45 AM, Wells, James Arthur <jw1@bcm.tmc.edu>
wrote:

> Certainly plan to. Just needed a stopgap since hardware is end-of-life…
>
>
>
> --James
>
>
>
> *From:* ActiveDir-owner@mail.activedir.org [mailto:
> ActiveDir-owner@mail.activedir.org] *On Behalf Of *Brian Desmond
> *Sent:* Monday, April 21, 2008 10:43 AM
> *To:* ActiveDir@mail.activedir.org
> *Subject:* Re: [ActiveDir] Adding extra IP to domain controller
>
>
>
> Should be fine. I'd still work on sunsetting the hardcoded apps though and
> at least changing them to use a generic DNS record.
>
>
>
> --brian
>
> On Mon, Apr 21, 2008 at 11:30 AM, Wells, James Arthur <jw1@bcm.tmc.edu>
> wrote:
>
> Will there be any unexpected consequences if I add an extra IP to a domain
> controller or two? We're replacing most of our domain controllers, but a
> handful of them are referenced by IP by some dumb applications...and we
> don't really want to keep the primary IP the same.
>
> I'm guessing there would be extra DNS records for each IP address - will
> there be any problems as a result?
>
>
>
> Thanks,
>
>
> --James
> List info : http://www.activedir.org/List.aspx
> List FAQ : http://www.activedir.org/ListFAQ.aspx
> List archive: http://www.activedir.org/ma/default.aspx
>
>
>
>
> --
> Thanks,
> Brian Desmond
> brian@briandesmond.com
>
> c - 312.731.3132
>



--
Thanks,
Brian Desmond
brian@briandesmond.com

c - 312.731.3132

kamleshapUser is Offline

Posts:27

04/22/2008 7:37 AM  
Just to add

Also that IP should be reachable from anywhere in network where domain
services are required.
Since DC will automatically create A record for it, non reachability will
affect replication, ldap queries, machine domain process etc.

--
Kamlesh
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Argue for your limitations, and sure enough, they're yours.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

On 4/21/08, Brian Desmond <brian@briandesmond.com> wrote:
>
> Yeah should be fine unless you've got some app connecting on LDAPS and
> validating the name on the certificate if you have new names and the same
> IP...
>
> --brian
>
>
> On Mon, Apr 21, 2008 at 11:45 AM, Wells, James Arthur <jw1@bcm.tmc.edu>
> wrote:
>
> > Certainly plan to. Just needed a stopgap since hardware is
> > end-of-life…
> >
> >
> >
> > --James
> >
> >
> >
> > *From:* ActiveDir-owner@mail.activedir.org [mailto:
> > ActiveDir-owner@mail.activedir.org] *On Behalf Of *Brian Desmond
> > *Sent:* Monday, April 21, 2008 10:43 AM
> > *To:* ActiveDir@mail.activedir.org
> > *Subject:* Re: [ActiveDir] Adding extra IP to domain controller
> >
> >
> >
> > Should be fine. I'd still work on sunsetting the hardcoded apps though
> > and at least changing them to use a generic DNS record.
> >
> >
> >
> > --brian
> >
> > On Mon, Apr 21, 2008 at 11:30 AM, Wells, James Arthur <jw1@bcm.tmc.edu>
> > wrote:
> >
> > Will there be any unexpected consequences if I add an extra IP to a
> > domain controller or two? We're replacing most of our domain controllers,
> > but a handful of them are referenced by IP by some dumb applications...and
> > we don't really want to keep the primary IP the same.
> >
> > I'm guessing there would be extra DNS records for each IP address - will
> > there be any problems as a result?
> >
> >
> >
> > Thanks,
> >
> >
> > --James
> > List info : http://www.activedir.org/List.aspx
> > List FAQ : http://www.activedir.org/ListFAQ.aspx
> > List archive: http://www.activedir.org/ma/default.aspx
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > Thanks,
> > Brian Desmond
> > brian@briandesmond.com
> >
> > c - 312.731.3132
> >
>
>
>
> --
> Thanks,
> Brian Desmond
> brian@briandesmond.com
>
> c - 312.731.3132
>

johnserbanUser is Offline

Posts:12

04/22/2008 12:07 PM  
So far, the responses have had two major assumptions:

1) The checkbox to "Register this connection's address in DNS"
will be selected on both network adapters

2) Both network segments are reachable by all clients who may
connect to the DC.



Kamlesh makes a valid point that "A" records will be registered for each
IP adapter, but more importantly for a DC, so will SRV records. Also,
with Dynamic registration, it is possible to register two IP addresses
but they will both register under the same DNS name, the computer name.
This makes it difficult to predict which IP address will be returned
when the DNS name is resolved by clients. Clients could resolve the DC
name to an unroutable IP address.



This list has a pretty wide audience and someone will probably respond
with a method to make the above scenario work successfully. However,
multi-homed domain controllers that advertise on multiple interfaces can
be tricky to implement, especially if all of the advertised subnets are
not universally reachable by all clients which attempt to connect to the
DC.



If your legacy application is not fully AD aware as you suggest by
stating the app accesses the DC by IP address, I would suggest not
dynamically registering that segment's address (uncheck "Register this
connection's address in DNS"). This method, if possible, will be much
less problematic to implement. The only caveat is if the DC is also a
DNS server. If the DC is a DNS server and the DNS service is bound to
the legacy segment network card, it will treat the network card as if
you had enabled dynamic registration. If you unbind the DNS server from
this card, it will prevent this from happening.



John



From: ActiveDir-owner@mail.activedir.org
[mailto:ActiveDir-owner@mail.activedir.org] On Behalf Of Kamlesh Parmar
Sent: Tuesday, April 22, 2008 7:34 AM
To: ActiveDir@mail.activedir.org
Subject: Re: [ActiveDir] Adding extra IP to domain controller



Just to add



Also that IP should be reachable from anywhere in network where domain
services are required.

Since DC will automatically create A record for it, non reachability
will affect replication, ldap queries, machine domain process etc.



--

Kamlesh

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Argue for your limitations, and sure enough, they're yours.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~



On 4/21/08, Brian Desmond <brian@briandesmond.com> wrote:

Yeah should be fine unless you've got some app connecting on LDAPS and
validating the name on the certificate if you have new names and the
same IP...



--brian



On Mon, Apr 21, 2008 at 11:45 AM, Wells, James Arthur <jw1@bcm.tmc.edu>
wrote:

Certainly plan to. Just needed a stopgap since hardware is
end-of-life...



--James



From: ActiveDir-owner@mail.activedir.org
[mailto:ActiveDir-owner@mail.activedir.org] On Behalf Of Brian Desmond
Sent: Monday, April 21, 2008 10:43 AM
To: ActiveDir@mail.activedir.org
Subject: Re: [ActiveDir] Adding extra IP to domain controller



Should be fine. I'd still work on sunsetting the hardcoded apps though
and at least changing them to use a generic DNS record.



--brian

On Mon, Apr 21, 2008 at 11:30 AM, Wells, James Arthur <jw1@bcm.tmc.edu>
wrote:

Will there be any unexpected consequences if I add an extra IP to a
domain controller or two? We're replacing most of our domain
controllers, but a handful of them are referenced by IP by some dumb
applications...and we don't really want to keep the primary IP the same.

I'm guessing there would be extra DNS records for each IP address - will
there be any problems as a result?



Thanks,


--James
List info : http://www.activedir.org/List.aspx
List FAQ : http://www.activedir.org/ListFAQ.aspx
List archive: http://www.activedir.org/ma/default.aspx




--
Thanks,
Brian Desmond
brian@briandesmond.com

c - 312.731.3132




--
Thanks,
Brian Desmond
brian@briandesmond.com

c - 312.731.3132






jw1User is Offline

Posts:0

04/22/2008 12:17 PM  
Sorry - should have noted; these are NOT multihomed. Single network interface.



-----Original Message-----
From: "Serban, John" <john.serban@wamu.net>
To: "ActiveDir@mail.activedir.org" <ActiveDir@mail.activedir.org>
Sent: 4/22/08 11:07 AM
Subject: RE: [ActiveDir] Adding extra IP to domain controller

So far, the responses have had two major assumptions:

1) The checkbox to "Register this connection's address in DNS"
will be selected on both network adapters

2) Both network segments are reachable by all clients who may
connect to the DC.



Kamlesh makes a valid point that "A" records will be registered for each
IP adapter, but more importantly for a DC, so will SRV records. Also,
with Dynamic registration, it is possible to register two IP addresses
but they will both register under the same DNS name, the computer name.
This makes it difficult to predict which IP address will be returned
when the DNS name is resolved by clients. Clients could resolve the DC
name to an unroutable IP address.



This list has a pretty wide audience and someone will probably respond
with a method to make the above scenario work successfully. However,
multi-homed domain controllers that advertise on multiple interfaces can
be tricky to implement, especially if all of the advertised subnets are
not universally reachable by all clients which attempt to connect to the
DC.



If your legacy application is not fully AD aware as you suggest by
stating the app accesses the DC by IP address, I would suggest not
dynamically registering that segment's address (uncheck "Register this
connection's address in DNS"). This method, if possible, will be much
less problematic to implement. The only caveat is if the DC is also a
DNS server. If the DC is a DNS server and the DNS service is bound to
the legacy segment network card, it will treat the network card as if
you had enabled dynamic registration. If you unbind the DNS server from
this card, it will prevent this from happening.



John



From: ActiveDir-owner@mail.activedir.org
[mailto:ActiveDir-owner@mail.activedir.org] On Behalf Of Kamlesh Parmar
Sent: Tuesday, April 22, 2008 7:34 AM
To: ActiveDir@mail.activedir.org
Subject: Re: [ActiveDir] Adding extra IP to domain controller



Just to add



Also that IP should be reachable from anywhere in network where domain
services are required.

Since DC will automatically create A record for it, non reachability
will affect replication, ldap queries, machine domain process etc.



--

Kamlesh

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Argue for your limitations, and sure enough, they're yours.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~



On 4/21/08, Brian Desmond <brian@briandesmond.com> wrote:

Yeah should be fine unless you've got some app connecting on LDAPS and
validating the name on the certificate if you have new names and the
same IP...



--brian



On Mon, Apr 21, 2008 at 11:45 AM, Wells, James Arthur <jw1@bcm.tmc.edu>
wrote:

Certainly plan to. Just needed a stopgap since hardware is
end-of-life...



--James



From: ActiveDir-owner@mail.activedir.org
[mailto:ActiveDir-owner@mail.activedir.org] On Behalf Of Brian Desmond
Sent: Monday, April 21, 2008 10:43 AM
To: ActiveDir@mail.activedir.org
Subject: Re: [ActiveDir] Adding extra IP to domain controller



Should be fine. I'd still work on sunsetting the hardcoded apps though
and at least changing them to use a generic DNS record.



--brian

On Mon, Apr 21, 2008 at 11:30 AM, Wells, James Arthur <jw1@bcm.tmc.edu>
wrote:

Will there be any unexpected consequences if I add an extra IP to a
domain controller or two? We're replacing most of our domain
controllers, but a handful of them are referenced by IP by some dumb
applications...and we don't really want to keep the primary IP the same.

I'm guessing there would be extra DNS records for each IP address - will
there be any problems as a result?



Thanks,


--James
List info : http://www.activedir.org/List.aspx
List FAQ : http://www.activedir.org/ListFAQ.aspx
List archive: http://www.activedir.org/ma/default.aspx




--
Thanks,
Brian Desmond
brian@briandesmond.com

c - 312.731.3132




--
Thanks,
Brian Desmond
brian@briandesmond.com

c - 312.731.3132





List info : http://www.activedir.org/List.aspx
List FAQ : http://www.activedir.org/ListFAQ.aspx
List archive: http://www.activedir.org/ma/default.aspx
akimmonsUser is Offline

Posts:9

04/22/2008 12:22 PM  
So are you saying that you just want to assign two different IP
addresses to the same NIC?



>>> "Wells, James Arthur" <jw1@bcm.tmc.edu> 04/22/08 10:12 AM >>>
Sorry - should have noted; these are NOT multihomed. Single network
interface.



-----Original Message-----
From: "Serban, John" <john.serban@wamu.net>
To: "ActiveDir@mail.activedir.org" <ActiveDir@mail.activedir.org>
Sent: 4/22/08 11:07 AM
Subject: RE: [ActiveDir] Adding extra IP to domain controller

So far, the responses have had two major assumptions:

1) The checkbox to "Register this connection's address in DNS"
will be selected on both network adapters

2) Both network segments are reachable by all clients who may
connect to the DC.



Kamlesh makes a valid point that "A" records will be registered for
each
IP adapter, but more importantly for a DC, so will SRV records. Also,
with Dynamic registration, it is possible to register two IP addresses
but they will both register under the same DNS name, the computer
name.
This makes it difficult to predict which IP address will be returned
when the DNS name is resolved by clients. Clients could resolve the
DC
name to an unroutable IP address.



This list has a pretty wide audience and someone will probably respond
with a method to make the above scenario work successfully. However,
multi-homed domain controllers that advertise on multiple interfaces
can
be tricky to implement, especially if all of the advertised subnets
are
not universally reachable by all clients which attempt to connect to
the
DC.



If your legacy application is not fully AD aware as you suggest by
stating the app accesses the DC by IP address, I would suggest not
dynamically registering that segment's address (uncheck "Register this
connection's address in DNS"). This method, if possible, will be much
less problematic to implement. The only caveat is if the DC is also a
DNS server. If the DC is a DNS server and the DNS service is bound to
the legacy segment network card, it will treat the network card as if
you had enabled dynamic registration. If you unbind the DNS server
from
this card, it will prevent this from happening.



John



From: ActiveDir-owner@mail.activedir.org
[mailto:ActiveDir-owner@mail.activedir.org] On Behalf Of Kamlesh
Parmar
Sent: Tuesday, April 22, 2008 7:34 AM
To: ActiveDir@mail.activedir.org
Subject: Re: [ActiveDir] Adding extra IP to domain controller



Just to add



Also that IP should be reachable from anywhere in network where domain
services are required.

Since DC will automatically create A record for it, non reachability
will affect replication, ldap queries, machine domain process etc.



--

Kamlesh

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Argue for your limitations, and sure enough, they're yours.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~



On 4/21/08, Brian Desmond <brian@briandesmond.com> wrote:

Yeah should be fine unless you've got some app connecting on LDAPS and
validating the name on the certificate if you have new names and the
same IP...



--brian



On Mon, Apr 21, 2008 at 11:45 AM, Wells, James Arthur
<jw1@bcm.tmc.edu>
wrote:

Certainly plan to. Just needed a stopgap since hardware is
end-of-life...



--James



From: ActiveDir-owner@mail.activedir.org
[mailto:ActiveDir-owner@mail.activedir.org] On Behalf Of Brian Desmond
Sent: Monday, April 21, 2008 10:43 AM
To: ActiveDir@mail.activedir.org
Subject: Re: [ActiveDir] Adding extra IP to domain controller



Should be fine. I'd still work on sunsetting the hardcoded apps though
and at least changing them to use a generic DNS record.



--brian

On Mon, Apr 21, 2008 at 11:30 AM, Wells, James Arthur
<jw1@bcm.tmc.edu>
wrote:

Will there be any unexpected consequences if I add an extra IP to a
domain controller or two? We're replacing most of our domain
controllers, but a handful of them are referenced by IP by some dumb
applications...and we don't really want to keep the primary IP the
same.

I'm guessing there would be extra DNS records for each IP address -
will
there be any problems as a result?



Thanks,


--James
List info : http://www.activedir.org/List.aspx
List FAQ : http://www.activedir.org/ListFAQ.aspx
List archive: http://www.activedir.org/ma/default.aspx




--
Thanks,
Brian Desmond
brian@briandesmond.com

c - 312.731.3132




--
Thanks,
Brian Desmond
brian@briandesmond.com

c - 312.731.3132





List info : http://www.activedir.org/List.aspx
List FAQ : http://www.activedir.org/ListFAQ.aspx
List archive: http://www.activedir.org/ma/default.aspx
List info : http://www.activedir.org/List.aspx
List FAQ : http://www.activedir.org/ListFAQ.aspx
List archive: http://www.activedir.org/ma/default.aspx
jw1User is Offline

Posts:0

04/22/2008 1:18 PM  
Yes

-----Original Message-----
From: ActiveDir-owner@mail.activedir.org [mailto:ActiveDir-owner@mail.activedir.org] On Behalf Of Anthony Kimmons
Sent: Tuesday, April 22, 2008 11:18 AM
To: ActiveDir@mail.activedir.org
Subject: RE: [ActiveDir] Adding extra IP to domain controller

So are you saying that you just want to assign two different IP
addresses to the same NIC?



>>> "Wells, James Arthur" <jw1@bcm.tmc.edu> 04/22/08 10:12 AM >>>
Sorry - should have noted; these are NOT multihomed. Single network
interface.



-----Original Message-----
From: "Serban, John" <john.serban@wamu.net>
To: "ActiveDir@mail.activedir.org" <ActiveDir@mail.activedir.org>
Sent: 4/22/08 11:07 AM
Subject: RE: [ActiveDir] Adding extra IP to domain controller

So far, the responses have had two major assumptions:

1) The checkbox to "Register this connection's address in DNS"
will be selected on both network adapters

2) Both network segments are reachable by all clients who may
connect to the DC.



Kamlesh makes a valid point that "A" records will be registered for
each
IP adapter, but more importantly for a DC, so will SRV records. Also,
with Dynamic registration, it is possible to register two IP addresses
but they will both register under the same DNS name, the computer
name.
This makes it difficult to predict which IP address will be returned
when the DNS name is resolved by clients. Clients could resolve the
DC
name to an unroutable IP address.



This list has a pretty wide audience and someone will probably respond
with a method to make the above scenario work successfully. However,
multi-homed domain controllers that advertise on multiple interfaces
can
be tricky to implement, especially if all of the advertised subnets
are
not universally reachable by all clients which attempt to connect to
the
DC.



If your legacy application is not fully AD aware as you suggest by
stating the app accesses the DC by IP address, I would suggest not
dynamically registering that segment's address (uncheck "Register this
connection's address in DNS"). This method, if possible, will be much
less problematic to implement. The only caveat is if the DC is also a
DNS server. If the DC is a DNS server and the DNS service is bound to
the legacy segment network card, it will treat the network card as if
you had enabled dynamic registration. If you unbind the DNS server
from
this card, it will prevent this from happening.



John



From: ActiveDir-owner@mail.activedir.org
[mailto:ActiveDir-owner@mail.activedir.org] On Behalf Of Kamlesh
Parmar
Sent: Tuesday, April 22, 2008 7:34 AM
To: ActiveDir@mail.activedir.org
Subject: Re: [ActiveDir] Adding extra IP to domain controller



Just to add



Also that IP should be reachable from anywhere in network where domain
services are required.

Since DC will automatically create A record for it, non reachability
will affect replication, ldap queries, machine domain process etc.



--

Kamlesh

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Argue for your limitations, and sure enough, they're yours.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~



On 4/21/08, Brian Desmond <brian@briandesmond.com> wrote:

Yeah should be fine unless you've got some app connecting on LDAPS and
validating the name on the certificate if you have new names and the
same IP...



--brian



On Mon, Apr 21, 2008 at 11:45 AM, Wells, James Arthur
<jw1@bcm.tmc.edu>
wrote:

Certainly plan to. Just needed a stopgap since hardware is
end-of-life...



--James



From: ActiveDir-owner@mail.activedir.org
[mailto:ActiveDir-owner@mail.activedir.org] On Behalf Of Brian Desmond
Sent: Monday, April 21, 2008 10:43 AM
To: ActiveDir@mail.activedir.org
Subject: Re: [ActiveDir] Adding extra IP to domain controller



Should be fine. I'd still work on sunsetting the hardcoded apps though
and at least changing them to use a generic DNS record.



--brian

On Mon, Apr 21, 2008 at 11:30 AM, Wells, James Arthur
<jw1@bcm.tmc.edu>
wrote:

Will there be any unexpected consequences if I add an extra IP to a
domain controller or two? We're replacing most of our domain
controllers, but a handful of them are referenced by IP by some dumb
applications...and we don't really want to keep the primary IP the
same.

I'm guessing there would be extra DNS records for each IP address -
will
there be any problems as a result?



Thanks,


--James
List info : http://www.activedir.org/List.aspx
List FAQ : http://www.activedir.org/ListFAQ.aspx
List archive: http://www.activedir.org/ma/default.aspx




--
Thanks,
Brian Desmond
brian@briandesmond.com

c - 312.731.3132




--
Thanks,
Brian Desmond
brian@briandesmond.com

c - 312.731.3132





List info : http://www.activedir.org/List.aspx
List FAQ : http://www.activedir.org/ListFAQ.aspx
List archive: http://www.activedir.org/ma/default.aspx
List info : http://www.activedir.org/List.aspx
List FAQ : http://www.activedir.org/ListFAQ.aspx
List archive: http://www.activedir.org/ma/default.aspx
List info : http://www.activedir.org/List.aspx
List FAQ : http://www.activedir.org/ListFAQ.aspx
List archive: http://www.activedir.org/ma/default.aspx
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