| Author | Messages | |
bsonposh
Posts:149
 | | 04/29/2008 3:35 PM |
| Susan, I think the key is Learning the WMI basics, .NET Basics, and learning
how to use the discovery tools built into Powershell like Get-Member
and Get-Help.
Dean and I have had this conversation a 1000s times. What Powershell really
needs is a built in MSDN offline.
btw... you may find these series by MoW helpful for your WMI exploits
http://thepowershellguy.com/blogs/posh/archive/tags/WMI+Explorer/default.aspx
On Tue, Apr 29, 2008 at 1:34 PM, Susan Bradley, CPA <sbradcpa@pacbell.net>
wrote:
> Not to mention not exactly "green" and energy compliant.
>
> I'm actually willing to (gasp) read something. I do have the PowerShell
> step by step and Scripting guides but am looking for a guide as well that
> covers WMI foundations. Yeah MSDN wallowing is fine but offline versions
> ...you know like a book... would be nice as well. :-)
>
> I'm asking for the IT consultant that has several SBS and ultimately EBS
> deployments as well.
>
>
> Akomolafe, Deji wrote:
>
> > I don't think typical SBS admins wade in the MSDN (cess)pool much,
> > Michael. Not enough of us "real" admins do so either, but it is too much to
> > expect from a "normal" SBS admin, IMO 
> >
> >
> > Sincerely,
> > _____
> > (, / | /) /) /)
> > /---| (/_ ______ ___// _ // _
> > ) / |_/(__(_) // (_(_)(/_(_(_/(__(/_
> > (_/ /)
> > (/
> > Microsoft MVP - Directory Services
> > www.akomolafe.name<http://www.akomolafe.name/> - we know IT
> > -5.75, -3.23
> > Do you now realize that Today is the Tomorrow you were worried about
> > Yesterday? -anon
> > ________________________________
> > From: ActiveDir-owner@mail.activedir.org [
> > ActiveDir-owner@mail.activedir.org] On Behalf Of Michael B. Smith
> > [michael@TheEssentialExchange.com]
> > Sent: Tuesday, April 29, 2008 10:17 AM
> > To: ActiveDir@mail.activedir.org
> > Subject: RE: [ActiveDir] [OT] BIND as Secondary DNS?
> >
> > >From one of my upcoming books:
> >
> >
> > WMI stands for Windows Management Instrumentation. WMI is the Microsoft
> > implementation of something known as CIM, which stands for Common
> > Information Model. CIM (and therefore WMI) is an industry-standard way of
> > representing information about computing objects. These objects include
> > processors, processes, tasks, networks, IP addresses, routers, switches,
> > etc. etc. There are literally hundreds of WMI objects implemented within
> > modern versions of Windows (WMI was first available in Windows 2000 Server).
> >
> > WMI provides a schema (that is, a description of the information that is
> > available) and a specification of the format of the data contained within
> > the schema. Within WMI, Microsoft has also defined a simple and standard
> > mechanism for accessing the information contained therein.
> > In my opinion, you get a great deal of value from spending time reading
> > the MSDN documents on (for example) Win32_Process. And if you get there, you
> > can see all the other Win32_* items. Drill down, and lo and behold, there is
> > a wealth of data.
> >
> > Within PowerShell, start with "gwmi win32_process | fl" and go from
> > there…
> >
> > http://msdn2.microsoft.com/en-us/library/aa394372(VS.85).aspx
> >
> > Regards,
> >
> > Michael B. Smith
> > MCSE/Exchange MVP
> > http://TheEssentialExchange.com <http://theessentialexchange.com/>
> >
> > From: ActiveDir-owner@mail.activedir.org [mailto:
> > ActiveDir-owner@mail.activedir.org] On Behalf Of Susan Bradley, CPA aka
> > Ebitz - SBS Rocks [MVP]
> > Sent: Tuesday, April 29, 2008 1:01 PM
> > To: ActiveDir@mail.activedir.org
> > Subject: Re: [ActiveDir] [OT] BIND as Secondary DNS?
> >
> > I think it's what you are used to and what makes sense to your platform.
> >
> > Up here in the GUI world PowerShell is being used all around me. SBS is
> > exposing it in the 2k8 era and using it for antispam cmdlets in Exchange
> > 2k7, move data scripting and it's being used in the backup tasks. IIS 7
> > just came out with a PowerShell platform as well.
> >
> > You and your blinking c prompt server core world it's understandable :-)
> >
> > Forgive the very newb question... in my platform I am looking at
> > PowerShell but find that the PowerShell scripting tutorials assume a
> > foundational knowledge of WMI, Common Information Model Standards and what
> > not. What resource would you gurus say is the best one for better
> > understanding these foundations?
> >
> >
> >
> > joe wrote:
> > Note that I am not saying no one else should be using PoS or .NET... I
> > am saying for me, it hasn't made any sense to do so IMO. I actually
> > recommend some others to use it because it would be the quickest easiest way
> > for them to spin up. But when people ask me to get involved with it, I don't
> > see the benefit *to me* to do so and say so. This includes writing wrappers,
> > etc for it because people seem to think I do certain things better than
> > others.
> >
> >
> > --
> > O'Reilly Active Directory Third Edition -
> > http://www.joeware.net/win/ad3e.htm
> >
> >
> >
> > ________________________________
> > From: ActiveDir-owner@mail.activedir.org<mailto:
> > ActiveDir-owner@mail.activedir.org> [mailto:
> > ActiveDir-owner@mail.activedir.org] On Behalf Of joe
> > Sent: Tuesday, April 29, 2008 12:42 PM
> > To: ActiveDir@mail.activedir.org<mailto:ActiveDir@mail.activedir.org>
> > Subject: RE: [ActiveDir] [OT] BIND as Secondary DNS?
> > Binary, Unicode, and large int can't be marshalled into text? How do you
> > know that isn't happening in the backend somewhere currently? Say some XML
> > stream of some sort? There is and has been a whole object passing model that
> > has existed for years and years and years called CORBA but the actual
> > implementation of that is a bit FAT for what we are talking about because it
> > needed to account for many things we don't care about in the command line
> > management world. But a similar idea slimmed down to the specific case of
> > passing data between two command line processes would be nice and it could
> > be published as a protocol instead of locking into a specific app model.
> >
> > I think you are happy that the data marshalling is done and you don't
> > have to deal with it, the fact that it is powershell or .net or anything
> > else doesn't really play into it. Anything given to you with the same
> > functionality would have been fine. It is like when people rave about
> > PowerShell because it lets them manage Exchange at the command line, that
> > isn't an argument for PowerShell, it is an argument for having anything that
> > can actually do what you need that didn't exist or possibly didn't know how
> > to do before.
> >
> > I like the idea of PowerShell, I think the .NET requirement was
> > extremely shortsighted considering it isn't what I would consider a first
> > class citizen of the OS. But I still don't see anything that PoS does for me
> > that makes me go, my god, I could never accomplish that any other way. Once
> > we start seeing kernel components written in and being run by .NET pieces
> > meaning perf has actually been looked at in some serious way, .NET will
> > start looking more attractive to me. Write now the arguments are mostly of
> > the variety that people gave for VB years ago and that wasn't enough to get
> > me to use VB either. Ditto Java. Now when Borland came out with Borland
> > Builder which gave me VB capability with native good c++ code, I was all
> > over that.
> >
> >
> > --
> > O'Reilly Active Directory Third Edition -
> > http://www.joeware.net/win/ad3e.htm
> >
> >
> >
> > ________________________________
> > From: ActiveDir-owner@mail.activedir.org<mailto:
> > ActiveDir-owner@mail.activedir.org> [mailto:
> > ActiveDir-owner@mail.activedir.org] On Behalf Of Brandon Shell
> > Sent: Tuesday, April 29, 2008 11:05 AM
> > To: ActiveDir@mail.activedir.org<mailto:ActiveDir@mail.activedir.org>
> > Subject: Re: [ActiveDir] [OT] BIND as Secondary DNS?
> > What about Binary Data? Unicode? or iADSLargeInteger. The biggest thing
> > you lose is ability to maintain the integrity of the object/text throughout
> > the pipe. Using .NET you know if you have FileInfo object it will stay a
> > FileInfo object until you decide to change it. The problem isn't passing the
> > text, it is knowing what to do with it on the flip side. The benefit you
> > have with the object model is Typing. I can TYPE the data so that there is
> > no ambiguity in the interpretation of the "text."
> >
> > I don't feel the need to debate the design of Powershell (that is water
> > under the bridge,) but the validity of the usefulness of dealing with
> > Objects. Ironically we both agree with the crapiness of the s.ds.d namespace
> > and ADSI in general, but that is a VERY small scope for Powershell. When it
> > comes to Dealing with Processes, Files, WMI, and the slew of other things
> > that Powershell Addresses from an Admin point of view using the .NET
> > namespace was a good idea.
> >
> > What Dushyant was talking about was, in Powershell you can have
> > Parameters that can be passed via the Pipe. These Parameters are determined
> > by Type or by Name. If it is a STRING it goes here, if it is a DATETIME it
> > goes there, if it is ... You get the idea. You can NOT achieve that passing
> > just text. It is just not feasible. Basically, I get your point, The
> > serialization is still done I just don't have to deal with it. This is the
> > draw. I don't have to worry about it. Not to mention it is SUPER powerful.
> >
> > In regards to "defined this standard passing mechanism" They did... its
> > called .NET Almost all the stuff they needed already had pre-defined .NET
> > classes that could be used.
> >
> > I really respect your opinion. You have a lot of experience, but I think
> > in this case you have been blinded by your hatred for .NET (albeit
> > understandable hatred.) Could Powershell have been done different...
> > absolutely. Could it have been done better... absolutely. Should they have
> > used .NET or just a standard parsing methods... that is converstation for
> > you and Jeffrey Snover.
> >
> > btw... Powershell is not a shell. It is an Engine similar to vbscript
> > parsing engine. They just have a shell that loads Powershell.
> > On Tue, Apr 29, 2008 at 9:48 AM, joe <listmail@joeware.net<mailto:
> > listmail@joeware.net>> wrote:
> > Give me an example or three of things you can do that you don't think
> > could be done otherwise that you believe to be a function of passing info
> > between programs (or if you prefer, call them cmdlets) that you can't do
> > with passing text. And as we were discussing at the summit, these should not
> > be things based on two apps not speaking the same language because no one
> > defined a protocol for the text streaming interchang, but things that
> > couldn't be done period even if that was defined. As you know and despite
> > the incorrect assumption/comment made by Dushyant in the PoS session,
> > Adfind/Mod and ds* can actually communicate with each other in great part
> > because I allowed it and that isn't all that hard as long as people agree on
> > a format. But give me an example of something that can't be done with that
> > object passing that you feel can't be accomplished if the
> > agreements/protocols aren't established.
> >
> > I think we would have been better served if MSFT had defined this
> > standard passing mechanism versus doing what was done. Something that wasn't
> > solely reliant on .NET. The .NET requirement is a silly requirement IMO.
> > Anyway, this wouldn't even need a whole new shell to pull off and the
> > foundation would have built up a lot faster and be far wider and accepted
> > now than it is. Again, IMO.
> >
> > joe
> >
> >
> > --
> > O'Reilly Active Directory Third Edition -
> > http://www.joeware.net/win/ad3e.htm
> >
> >
> >
> > ________________________________
> > From: ActiveDir-owner@mail.activedir.org<mailto:
> > ActiveDir-owner@mail.activedir.org> [mailto:
> > ActiveDir-owner@mail.activedir.org<mailto:
> > ActiveDir-owner@mail.activedir.org>] On Behalf Of Brandon Shell
> > Sent: Tuesday, April 29, 2008 9:34 AM
> >
> > To: ActiveDir@mail.activedir.org<mailto:ActiveDir@mail.activedir.org>
> > Subject: Re: [ActiveDir] [OT] BIND as Secondary DNS?
> >
> > While I still think it would be cool for you to write them... I have
> > S.DS.P now... That solves my immediate need so I can do the rest
> >
> > It may not be as fast as ADFind, but the flexibility of objects will
> > more than make up for that time lost with my ability to process the output.
> >
> > To be clear... I think ADFind and ADMod awesome tools and I am very
> > grateful for them.
> > On Tue, Apr 29, 2008 at 9:08 AM, joe <listmail@joeware.net<mailto:
> > listmail@joeware.net>> wrote:
> > Absolutely, I just don't consider that exploring... If I did explore
> > that area, it would be to work out how to write native code to interface
> > with it.
> >
> > If ya want it to so bad... you write it.
> >
> > joe
> >
> >
> > --
> > O'Reilly Active Directory Third Edition -
> > http://www.joeware.net/win/ad3e.htm
> >
> > Those who can.... do.
> > Those who can't... beg.
> >
> >
> > ________________________________
> > From: ActiveDir-owner@mail.activedir.org<mailto:
> > ActiveDir-owner@mail.activedir.org> [mailto:
> > ActiveDir-owner@mail.activedir.org<mailto:
> > ActiveDir-owner@mail.activedir.org>] On Behalf Of Brandon Shell
> > Sent: Tuesday, April 29, 2008 9:02 AM
> >
> > To: ActiveDir@mail.activedir.org<mailto:ActiveDir@mail.activedir.org>
> > Subject: Re: [ActiveDir] [OT] BIND as Secondary DNS?
> > never stop exploring... 
> > On Tue, Apr 29, 2008 at 8:50 AM, joe <listmail@joeware.net<mailto:
> > listmail@joeware.net>> wrote:
> > Very funnyΏ]....
> >
> > 
> >
> > joe
> >
> >
> > Ώ] But accurate
> >
> >
> > --
> > O'Reilly Active Directory Third Edition -
> > http://www.joeware.net/win/ad3e.htm
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: ActiveDir-owner@mail.activedir.org<mailto:
> > ActiveDir-owner@mail.activedir.org>
> > [mailto:ActiveDir-owner@mail.activedir.org<mailto:
> > ActiveDir-owner@mail.activedir.org>] On Behalf Of Dean Wells
> > Sent: Tuesday, April 29, 2008 8:17 AM
> > To: ActiveDir@mail.activedir.org<mailto:ActiveDir@mail.activedir.org>
> > Subject: RE: [ActiveDir] [OT] BIND as Secondary DNS?
> >
> > Hehe ... and not entirely dissimilar to what happens when people ask joe
> > .NET/Powershell questions in-person; joe: can you write a wrapper ...
> > joe?
> > joe? ... where'd he go?
> >
> > --
> > Dean Wells
> > MSEtechnology
> > t Email: dwells@msetechnology.com<mailto:dwells@msetechnology.com>
> > http://msetechnology.com<http://msetechnology.com/>
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: ActiveDir-owner@mail.activedir.org<mailto:
> > ActiveDir-owner@mail.activedir.org>
> > [mailto:ActiveDir-owner@mail.activedir.org<mailto:
> > ActiveDir-owner@mail.activedir.org>] On Behalf Of Richard Kline
> > Sent: Monday, April 28, 2008 10:20 AM
> > To: ActiveDir@mail.activedir.org<mailto:ActiveDir@mail.activedir.org>
> > Subject: RE: [ActiveDir] [OT] BIND as Secondary DNS?
> >
> > First Nomination for Understatement of the Year award:
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: ActiveDir-owner@mail.activedir.org<mailto:
> > ActiveDir-owner@mail.activedir.org>
> > [mailto:ActiveDir-owner@mail.activedir.org<mailto:
> > ActiveDir-owner@mail.activedir.org>] On Behalf Of joe
> > Sent: Sunday, April 27, 2008 4:28 PM
> > To: ActiveDir@mail.activedir.org<mailto:ActiveDir@mail.activedir.org>
> > Subject: RE: [ActiveDir] [OT] BIND as Secondary DNS?
> >
> > ...
> >
> > A DNS server that is dynamically handed its address is NOT the most
> > useful
> > device you could have on a network...
> >
> >
> > joe
> >
> >
> > List info : http://www.activedir.org/List.aspx
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> >
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> >
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> >
> >
> >
> > List info : http://www.activedir.org/List.aspx List FAQ :
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> >
> >
> >
>
> List info : http://www.activedir.org/List.aspx
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>
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