| Author | Messages | |
Tony
Posts:117
 | | 10/21/2008 5:15 PM |
| Hi all
Just curious to gauge the general feeling about running WS2008 DCs on Server
Core.
Do you consider it a best practice to run all DCs on Server Core, despite
the increased setup overhead? Or are you perhaps reserving Server Core only
for RODCs in branch offices?
Server Core doesn't (yet) support the .Net Framework (and hence Powershell),
but does is this causing anyone any real pain? There are workarounds after
all.
Tony
| | | |
| PARRIS
Posts:217
| | 10/21/2008 5:27 PM |
| Tony,
I have been looking at running server core on a Cisco WAAS appliance for
several continental operations as it can now can host the DC as a Hyper-V
machine, testing will begin soon.
Mark
From: ActiveDir-owner@mail.activedir.org
[mailto:ActiveDir-owner@mail.activedir.org] On Behalf Of Tony Murray
Sent: 21 October 2008 22:11
To: ActiveDir@mail.activedir.org
Subject: AD: [ActiveDir] DCs on Server Core
Hi all
Just curious to gauge the general feeling about running WS2008 DCs on Server
Core.
Do you consider it a best practice to run all DCs on Server Core, despite
the increased setup overhead? Or are you perhaps reserving Server Core only
for RODCs in branch offices?
Server Core doesn't (yet) support the .Net Framework (and hence Powershell),
but does is this causing anyone any real pain? There are workarounds after
all.
Tony
| | | |
| bdesmond
Posts:813
| | 10/21/2008 5:33 PM |
| I'd be inclined to push it to any customer that I was doing 2008 deployments for. I've certainly said to in hallway conversations.
The lack of .NET and PowerShell doesn't really strike me as a deployment blocker.
Thanks,
Brian Desmond
brian@briandesmond.com
c - 312.731.3132
From: ActiveDir-owner@mail.activedir.org [mailto:ActiveDir-owner@mail.activedir.org] On Behalf Of Tony Murray
Sent: Tuesday, October 21, 2008 4:11 PM
To: ActiveDir@mail.activedir.org
Subject: [ActiveDir] DCs on Server Core
Hi all
Just curious to gauge the general feeling about running WS2008 DCs on Server Core.
Do you consider it a best practice to run all DCs on Server Core, despite the increased setup overhead? Or are you perhaps reserving Server Core only for RODCs in branch offices?
Server Core doesn't (yet) support the .Net Framework (and hence Powershell), but does is this causing anyone any real pain? There are workarounds after all.
Tony
| | | |
| danholme
Posts:164
| | 10/21/2008 5:57 PM |
| Add my vote to Brians. For sure.
Dan
From: ActiveDir-owner@mail.activedir.org
[mailto:ActiveDir-owner@mail.activedir.org] On Behalf Of Brian Desmond
Sent: Tuesday, October 21, 2008 11:27 AM
To: ActiveDir@mail.activedir.org
Subject: RE: [ActiveDir] DCs on Server Core
I'd be inclined to push it to any customer that I was doing 2008
deployments for. I've certainly said to in hallway conversations.
The lack of .NET and PowerShell doesn't really strike me as a deployment
blocker.
Thanks,
Brian Desmond
brian@briandesmond.com
c - 312.731.3132
From: ActiveDir-owner@mail.activedir.org
[mailto:ActiveDir-owner@mail.activedir.org] On Behalf Of Tony Murray
Sent: Tuesday, October 21, 2008 4:11 PM
To: ActiveDir@mail.activedir.org
Subject: [ActiveDir] DCs on Server Core
Hi all
Just curious to gauge the general feeling about running WS2008 DCs on
Server Core.
Do you consider it a best practice to run all DCs on Server Core,
despite the increased setup overhead? Or are you perhaps reserving
Server Core only for RODCs in branch offices?
Server Core doesn't (yet) support the .Net Framework (and hence
Powershell), but does is this causing anyone any real pain? There are
workarounds after all.
Tony
| | | |
| TG
Posts:253
| | 10/21/2008 6:12 PM |
| Considering as a recommendation for DMZ in our organization.
Thank you, Tony.
Tony Gordon
Windows 2003 & 2000 MCSE, Windows 2003 MCSA, PMP
ITS Infrastructure Engineering
Hewitt Associates | 100 Half Day Road | Lincolnshire, IL 60069 |
USA
Tel 847.295.5000 x50526 | Fax 847.554.1574
tony dot gordon at hewitt dot com | www.hewitt.com
From:
"Tony Murray" <tony@activedir.org>
To:
ActiveDir@mail.activedir.org
Date:
10/21/2008 04:10 PM
Subject:
[ActiveDir] DCs on Server Core
Hi all
Just curious to gauge the general feeling about running WS2008 DCs on
Server Core.
Do you consider it a best practice to run all DCs on Server Core, despite
the increased setup overhead? Or are you perhaps reserving Server Core
only for RODCs in branch offices?
Server Core doesn?t (yet) support the .Net Framework (and hence
Powershell), but does is this causing anyone any real pain? There are
workarounds after all.
Tony
The information contained in this e-mail and any accompanying documents may contain information that is confidential or otherwise protected from disclosure. If you are not the intended recipient of this message, or if this message has been addressed to you in error, please immediately alert the sender by reply e-mail and then delete this message, including any attachments. Any dissemination, distribution or other use of the contents of this message by anyone other than the intended recipient is strictly prohibited. All messages sent to and from this e-mail address may be monitored as permitted by applicable law and regulations to ensure compliance with our internal policies and to protect our business. E-mails are not secure and cannot be guaranteed to be error free as they can be intercepted, amended, lost or destroyed, or contain viruses. You are deemed to have accepted these risks if you communicate with us by e-mail.
| | | |
| bsonposh
Posts:380
| | 10/21/2008 6:24 PM |
| Strangly enough, I agree with Brian, but I think Powershell works just
fine remotely. I see no need to have it local.
On 10/21/08, Tony Gordon <Tony.Gordon@hewitt.com> wrote:
> Considering as a recommendation for DMZ in our organization.
>
> Thank you, Tony.
>
>
> Tony Gordon
> Windows 2003 & 2000 MCSE, Windows 2003 MCSA, PMP
> ITS Infrastructure Engineering
> Hewitt Associates | 100 Half Day Road | Lincolnshire, IL 60069 |
> USA
> Tel 847.295.5000 x50526 | Fax 847.554.1574
> tony dot gordon at hewitt dot com | www.hewitt.com
>
>
>
> From:
> "Tony Murray" <tony@activedir.org>
> To:
> ActiveDir@mail.activedir.org
> Date:
> 10/21/2008 04:10 PM
> Subject:
> [ActiveDir] DCs on Server Core
>
>
>
> Hi all
>
> Just curious to gauge the general feeling about running WS2008 DCs on
> Server Core.
>
> Do you consider it a best practice to run all DCs on Server Core, despite
> the increased setup overhead? Or are you perhaps reserving Server Core
> only for RODCs in branch offices?
>
> Server Core doesn?t (yet) support the .Net Framework (and hence
> Powershell), but does is this causing anyone any real pain? There are
> workarounds after all.
>
> Tony
>
>
>
>
>
>
> The information contained in this e-mail and any accompanying documents may
> contain information that is confidential or otherwise protected from
> disclosure. If you are not the intended recipient of this message, or if
> this message has been addressed to you in error, please immediately alert
> the sender by reply e-mail and then delete this message, including any
> attachments. Any dissemination, distribution or other use of the contents of
> this message by anyone other than the intended recipient is strictly
> prohibited. All messages sent to and from this e-mail address may be
> monitored as permitted by applicable law and regulations to ensure
> compliance with our internal policies and to protect our business. E-mails
> are not secure and cannot be guaranteed to be error free as they can be
> intercepted, amended, lost or destroyed, or contain viruses. You are deemed
> to have accepted these risks if you communicate with us by e-mail.
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>
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| | | |
| Tony
Posts:117
| | 10/21/2008 7:11 PM |
| For those of you that have gone for an AD implementation based purely on
Server Core, do you have any insights to share on the experience? Any
significant issues or challenges, or does it all work seamlessly?
Tony
From: ActiveDir-owner@mail.activedir.org
[mailto:ActiveDir-owner@mail.activedir.org] On Behalf Of Dan Holme
Sent: Wednesday, 22 October 2008 10:53 a.m.
To: ActiveDir@mail.activedir.org
Subject: RE: [ActiveDir] DCs on Server Core
Add my vote to Brians. For sure.
Dan
From: ActiveDir-owner@mail.activedir.org
[mailto:ActiveDir-owner@mail.activedir.org] On Behalf Of Brian Desmond
Sent: Tuesday, October 21, 2008 11:27 AM
To: ActiveDir@mail.activedir.org
Subject: RE: [ActiveDir] DCs on Server Core
I'd be inclined to push it to any customer that I was doing 2008 deployments
for. I've certainly said to in hallway conversations.
The lack of .NET and PowerShell doesn't really strike me as a deployment
blocker.
Thanks,
Brian Desmond
brian@briandesmond.com
c - 312.731.3132
From: ActiveDir-owner@mail.activedir.org
[mailto:ActiveDir-owner@mail.activedir.org] On Behalf Of Tony Murray
Sent: Tuesday, October 21, 2008 4:11 PM
To: ActiveDir@mail.activedir.org
Subject: [ActiveDir] DCs on Server Core
Hi all
Just curious to gauge the general feeling about running WS2008 DCs on Server
Core.
Do you consider it a best practice to run all DCs on Server Core, despite
the increased setup overhead? Or are you perhaps reserving Server Core only
for RODCs in branch offices?
Server Core doesn't (yet) support the .Net Framework (and hence Powershell),
but does is this causing anyone any real pain? There are workarounds after
all.
Tony
| | | |
| robertsingers
Posts:498
| | 10/21/2008 7:13 PM |
| I was recently considering whether we roll out Server Core for all our
DCs and I decided against it because the skill level in our operations
team isn't high enough to take away GUIised and Wizardised things.
To me best practice is to have your environment properly supported and
compliant with everything you need to be compliant with. So I'd unpack
the question and ask what are the support requirements for
- a RWDC running Server Core
- a RWDC with DHCP, DNS, WINS, KMS running Server Core
- a RODC running Server Core
and just for kicks
- a member server running print services.
>From that you should be able to come to a best practice statement.
________________________________
From: ActiveDir-owner@mail.activedir.org
[mailto:ActiveDir-owner@mail.activedir.org] On Behalf Of Dan Holme
Sent: Wednesday, 22 October 2008 10:53 a.m.
To: ActiveDir@mail.activedir.org
Subject: RE: [ActiveDir] DCs on Server Core
Add my vote to Brians. For sure.
Dan
From: ActiveDir-owner@mail.activedir.org
[mailto:ActiveDir-owner@mail.activedir.org] On Behalf Of Brian Desmond
Sent: Tuesday, October 21, 2008 11:27 AM
To: ActiveDir@mail.activedir.org
Subject: RE: [ActiveDir] DCs on Server Core
I'd be inclined to push it to any customer that I was doing 2008
deployments for. I've certainly said to in hallway conversations.
The lack of .NET and PowerShell doesn't really strike me as a deployment
blocker.
Thanks,
Brian Desmond
brian@briandesmond.com
c - 312.731.3132
From: ActiveDir-owner@mail.activedir.org
[mailto:ActiveDir-owner@mail.activedir.org] On Behalf Of Tony Murray
Sent: Tuesday, October 21, 2008 4:11 PM
To: ActiveDir@mail.activedir.org
Subject: [ActiveDir] DCs on Server Core
Hi all
Just curious to gauge the general feeling about running WS2008 DCs on
Server Core.
Do you consider it a best practice to run all DCs on Server Core,
despite the increased setup overhead? Or are you perhaps reserving
Server Core only for RODCs in branch offices?
Server Core doesn't (yet) support the .Net Framework (and hence
Powershell), but does is this causing anyone any real pain? There are
workarounds after all.
Tony
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| | | |
| deji
Posts:257
| | 10/21/2008 7:25 PM |
| Unfortunately, I have so far had no luck convincing any client to bite on Server Core for their DCs. I'll keep trying, but even telling the admins that they could administer the DCs remotely using many of the familiar GUI tools has not been enough to overcome the "what-do-you-mean-we-can't-get-xyz??!!!" reactions.
Sincerely,
_____
(, / | /) /) /)
/---| (/_ ______ ___// _ // _
) / |_/(__(_) // (_(_)(/_(_(_/(__(/_
(_/ /)
(/
Microsoft MVP - Directory Services
www.akomolafe.name<http://www.akomolafe.name/> - we know IT
-5.75, -3.23
Do you now realize that Today is the Tomorrow you were worried about Yesterday? -anon
________________________________
From: ActiveDir-owner@mail.activedir.org [ActiveDir-owner@mail.activedir.org] On Behalf Of Tony Murray [tony@activedir.org]
Sent: Tuesday, October 21, 2008 4:06 PM
To: ActiveDir@mail.activedir.org
Subject: RE: [ActiveDir] DCs on Server Core
For those of you that have gone for an AD implementation based purely on Server Core, do you have any insights to share on the experience? Any significant issues or challenges, or does it all work seamlessly?
Tony
From: ActiveDir-owner@mail.activedir.org [mailto:ActiveDir-owner@mail.activedir.org] On Behalf Of Dan Holme
Sent: Wednesday, 22 October 2008 10:53 a.m.
To: ActiveDir@mail.activedir.org
Subject: RE: [ActiveDir] DCs on Server Core
Add my vote to Brians. For sure.
Dan
From: ActiveDir-owner@mail.activedir.org [mailto:ActiveDir-owner@mail.activedir.org] On Behalf Of Brian Desmond
Sent: Tuesday, October 21, 2008 11:27 AM
To: ActiveDir@mail.activedir.org
Subject: RE: [ActiveDir] DCs on Server Core
I’d be inclined to push it to any customer that I was doing 2008 deployments for. I’ve certainly said to in hallway conversations.
The lack of .NET and PowerShell doesn’t really strike me as a deployment blocker.
Thanks,
Brian Desmond
brian@briandesmond.com
c - 312.731.3132
From: ActiveDir-owner@mail.activedir.org [mailto:ActiveDir-owner@mail.activedir.org] On Behalf Of Tony Murray
Sent: Tuesday, October 21, 2008 4:11 PM
To: ActiveDir@mail.activedir.org
Subject: [ActiveDir] DCs on Server Core
Hi all
Just curious to gauge the general feeling about running WS2008 DCs on Server Core.
Do you consider it a best practice to run all DCs on Server Core, despite the increased setup overhead? Or are you perhaps reserving Server Core only for RODCs in branch offices?
Server Core doesn’t (yet) support the .Net Framework (and hence Powershell), but does is this causing anyone any real pain? There are workarounds after all.
Tony
List info : http://www.activedir.org/List.aspx
List FAQ : http://www.activedir.org/ListFAQ.aspx
List archive: http://www.activedir.org/ma/default.aspx
| | | |
| listmail
Posts:752
| | 10/22/2008 2:42 AM |
| I don't think the setup overhead should be a major concern, deployment is
such a small piece of the puzzle. Just think of the overhead you will save
on patching time. How many patches have come out now that said "Does not
apply to Windows Server Core"? Plus once you get the deployment script down,
should be a pretty easy cookie cutter. If you are doing it manually, you
probably aren't large enough to justify using server core anyway. Server
core, IMO, will be more for the medium to large orgs that have more skilled
admins who won't be afraid of the dark black CMD prompt staring at them.
Once you are big enough to start truly distinguishing between branch site
and hub site, you are likely big enough for server core AND you are big
enough to be automating your builds and getting admins who have a clue or
the ability to learn a clue on how to manage outside of the point and click
paradigm.
The lack of .NET and Powershell I see as a non-issue both because I dislike
them and because you can still use most of that stuff remotely if truly
needed. I do see the lack of .NET as a stopper for heavy WEB Server
utilization of Server Core though which is a bit sad as I think that is a
good role for server core.
I really see virtualized Server Core RODCs hitting branch sites. Server Core
Full DCs in hub sites. Makes the whole domain overall more secure as you
have less attack vectors sitting on your DCs and sort of forces a slightly
higher skill level for managing them.
joe
--
O'Reilly Active Directory Third Edition -
http://www.joeware.net/win/ad3e.htm
_____
From: ActiveDir-owner@mail.activedir.org
[mailto:ActiveDir-owner@mail.activedir.org] On Behalf Of Tony Murray
Sent: Tuesday, October 21, 2008 5:11 PM
To: ActiveDir@mail.activedir.org
Subject: [ActiveDir] DCs on Server Core
Hi all
Just curious to gauge the general feeling about running WS2008 DCs on Server
Core.
Do you consider it a best practice to run all DCs on Server Core, despite
the increased setup overhead? Or are you perhaps reserving Server Core only
for RODCs in branch offices?
Server Core doesn't (yet) support the .Net Framework (and hence Powershell),
but does is this causing anyone any real pain? There are workarounds after
all.
Tony
| | | |
| GuidoG
Posts:100
| | 10/22/2008 3:27 AM |
| Fully second joe's thoughts here. I'm in the midst of planning a large Win2008 upgrade for a customer - will take a while until the various aspects of the planning is done, but implementation will start early next year. Server Core x64 definitely platform of choice, though we'll likely still have one or two of the RWDCs per domain running on Full Server in the Data Centers.
Unlike joe I do miss PowerShell on Server Core, but we can live without it as it's not problem to use remotely. But I'm still hoping MSFT will be able to sufficiently progress on Win2008 R2 to only get those parts of the .NET framework on Core that allows it to run PowerShell locally.
/Guido
From: ActiveDir-owner@mail.activedir.org [mailto:ActiveDir-owner@mail.activedir.org] On Behalf Of joe
Sent: Wednesday, October 22, 2008 8:39 AM
To: ActiveDir@mail.activedir.org
Subject: RE: [ActiveDir] DCs on Server Core
I don't think the setup overhead should be a major concern, deployment is such a small piece of the puzzle. Just think of the overhead you will save on patching time. How many patches have come out now that said "Does not apply to Windows Server Core"? Plus once you get the deployment script down, should be a pretty easy cookie cutter. If you are doing it manually, you probably aren't large enough to justify using server core anyway. Server core, IMO, will be more for the medium to large orgs that have more skilled admins who won't be afraid of the dark black CMD prompt staring at them. Once you are big enough to start truly distinguishing between branch site and hub site, you are likely big enough for server core AND you are big enough to be automating your builds and getting admins who have a clue or the ability to learn a clue on how to manage outside of the point and click paradigm.
The lack of .NET and Powershell I see as a non-issue both because I dislike them and because you can still use most of that stuff remotely if truly needed. I do see the lack of .NET as a stopper for heavy WEB Server utilization of Server Core though which is a bit sad as I think that is a good role for server core.
I really see virtualized Server Core RODCs hitting branch sites. Server Core Full DCs in hub sites. Makes the whole domain overall more secure as you have less attack vectors sitting on your DCs and sort of forces a slightly higher skill level for managing them.
joe
--
O'Reilly Active Directory Third Edition - http://www.joeware.net/win/ad3e.htm
________________________________
From: ActiveDir-owner@mail.activedir.org [mailto:ActiveDir-owner@mail.activedir.org] On Behalf Of Tony Murray
Sent: Tuesday, October 21, 2008 5:11 PM
To: ActiveDir@mail.activedir.org
Subject: [ActiveDir] DCs on Server Core
Hi all
Just curious to gauge the general feeling about running WS2008 DCs on Server Core.
Do you consider it a best practice to run all DCs on Server Core, despite the increased setup overhead? Or are you perhaps reserving Server Core only for RODCs in branch offices?
Server Core doesn't (yet) support the .Net Framework (and hence Powershell), but does is this causing anyone any real pain? There are workarounds after all.
Tony
| | | |
| Tony
Posts:117
| | 10/22/2008 3:56 PM |
| Good info guys, thanks.
I guess where I am coming from on this is to see if there are any compelling
arguments against the use of Server Core for DCs. So far I haven't heard
any, but I'm still seeing a fair few organisations choosing the full version
as part of their design. I guess it's just a step too far out of the
comfort zone for some.
Personally, I see Server Core as the future of the Windows Server platform.
I wouldn't be surprised if we see Windows become Server Core-only some time
in the next 10 years. I think we'll start to see a lot of virtualised
Server Core instances performing specific roles on shared hardware. So for
those small shops still loving the UI, the writing is on the wall.
Microsoft does need to sort out the .NET angle though - make it modular to
allow local Server Core support.
Guido, I'm curious as to what reasons you have for maintaining "one or two
of the RWDCs" in the Data Centres?
Tony
From: ActiveDir-owner@mail.activedir.org
[mailto:ActiveDir-owner@mail.activedir.org] On Behalf Of Grillenmeier, Guido
Sent: Wednesday, 22 October 2008 8:23 p.m.
To: ActiveDir@mail.activedir.org
Subject: RE: [ActiveDir] DCs on Server Core
Fully second joe's thoughts here. I'm in the midst of planning a large
Win2008 upgrade for a customer - will take a while until the various aspects
of the planning is done, but implementation will start early next year.
Server Core x64 definitely platform of choice, though we'll likely still
have one or two of the RWDCs per domain running on Full Server in the Data
Centers.
Unlike joe I do miss PowerShell on Server Core, but we can live without it
as it's not problem to use remotely. But I'm still hoping MSFT will be able
to sufficiently progress on Win2008 R2 to only get those parts of the .NET
framework on Core that allows it to run PowerShell locally.
/Guido
From: ActiveDir-owner@mail.activedir.org
[mailto:ActiveDir-owner@mail.activedir.org] On Behalf Of joe
Sent: Wednesday, October 22, 2008 8:39 AM
To: ActiveDir@mail.activedir.org
Subject: RE: [ActiveDir] DCs on Server Core
I don't think the setup overhead should be a major concern, deployment is
such a small piece of the puzzle. Just think of the overhead you will save
on patching time. How many patches have come out now that said "Does not
apply to Windows Server Core"? Plus once you get the deployment script down,
should be a pretty easy cookie cutter. If you are doing it manually, you
probably aren't large enough to justify using server core anyway. Server
core, IMO, will be more for the medium to large orgs that have more skilled
admins who won't be afraid of the dark black CMD prompt staring at them.
Once you are big enough to start truly distinguishing between branch site
and hub site, you are likely big enough for server core AND you are big
enough to be automating your builds and getting admins who have a clue or
the ability to learn a clue on how to manage outside of the point and click
paradigm.
The lack of .NET and Powershell I see as a non-issue both because I dislike
them and because you can still use most of that stuff remotely if truly
needed. I do see the lack of .NET as a stopper for heavy WEB Server
utilization of Server Core though which is a bit sad as I think that is a
good role for server core.
I really see virtualized Server Core RODCs hitting branch sites. Server Core
Full DCs in hub sites. Makes the whole domain overall more secure as you
have less attack vectors sitting on your DCs and sort of forces a slightly
higher skill level for managing them.
joe
--
O'Reilly Active Directory Third Edition -
http://www.joeware.net/win/ad3e.htm
_____
From: ActiveDir-owner@mail.activedir.org
[mailto:ActiveDir-owner@mail.activedir.org] On Behalf Of Tony Murray
Sent: Tuesday, October 21, 2008 5:11 PM
To: ActiveDir@mail.activedir.org
Subject: [ActiveDir] DCs on Server Core
Hi all
Just curious to gauge the general feeling about running WS2008 DCs on Server
Core.
Do you consider it a best practice to run all DCs on Server Core, despite
the increased setup overhead? Or are you perhaps reserving Server Core only
for RODCs in branch offices?
Server Core doesn't (yet) support the .Net Framework (and hence Powershell),
but does is this causing anyone any real pain? There are workarounds after
all.
Tony
| | | |
| listmail
Posts:752
| | 10/22/2008 6:31 PM |
| I concur, it is the future of Windows Server. You may still see versions of
it that *may* be all GUI like SBS but I think this a chance for the SBS Team
to step a little away from the full GUI and develop a specific simple GUI
(or even shell) that works on Server Core that is specific to SBS needs. Of
course in order to do that, the kitcken sink they put on there also needs to
all be able to run on Server Core which may not happen. Though once they get
.NET ported to Server Core, then maybe the extra baggage apps in the box
will work too.
I think many will use Full Server OS versions because they are afraid of
their ability (or have no ability) to manage server core. Hopefully that
fear will subside and/or the quality of admins will increase. Once more and
more resources and documentation is out there for Server Core for people to
use such as targeted tools/scripts etc I see Server Core getting more and
more popular with the smaller orgs. Initially I think the larger orgs will
in general love the idea, smaller orgs will be repulsed, or at least the
admins that only know point in click in the smaller orgs will be repulsed.
Some portion of .NET and PoS will get shoehorned in, I have no doubt about
that. There are hacking methods to do it now if you really want it.
joe
--
O'Reilly Active Directory Third Edition -
http://www.joeware.net/win/ad3e.htm
_____
From: ActiveDir-owner@mail.activedir.org
[mailto:ActiveDir-owner@mail.activedir.org] On Behalf Of Tony Murray
Sent: Wednesday, October 22, 2008 3:53 PM
To: ActiveDir@mail.activedir.org
Subject: RE: [ActiveDir] DCs on Server Core
Good info guys, thanks.
I guess where I am coming from on this is to see if there are any compelling
arguments against the use of Server Core for DCs. So far I haven't heard
any, but I'm still seeing a fair few organisations choosing the full version
as part of their design. I guess it's just a step too far out of the
comfort zone for some.
Personally, I see Server Core as the future of the Windows Server platform.
I wouldn't be surprised if we see Windows become Server Core-only some time
in the next 10 years. I think we'll start to see a lot of virtualised
Server Core instances performing specific roles on shared hardware. So for
those small shops still loving the UI, the writing is on the wall.
Microsoft does need to sort out the .NET angle though - make it modular to
allow local Server Core support.
Guido, I'm curious as to what reasons you have for maintaining "one or two
of the RWDCs" in the Data Centres?
Tony
From: ActiveDir-owner@mail.activedir.org
[mailto:ActiveDir-owner@mail.activedir.org] On Behalf Of Grillenmeier, Guido
Sent: Wednesday, 22 October 2008 8:23 p.m.
To: ActiveDir@mail.activedir.org
Subject: RE: [ActiveDir] DCs on Server Core
Fully second joe's thoughts here. I'm in the midst of planning a large
Win2008 upgrade for a customer - will take a while until the various aspects
of the planning is done, but implementation will start early next year.
Server Core x64 definitely platform of choice, though we'll likely still
have one or two of the RWDCs per domain running on Full Server in the Data
Centers.
Unlike joe I do miss PowerShell on Server Core, but we can live without it
as it's not problem to use remotely. But I'm still hoping MSFT will be able
to sufficiently progress on Win2008 R2 to only get those parts of the .NET
framework on Core that allows it to run PowerShell locally.
/Guido
From: ActiveDir-owner@mail.activedir.org
[mailto:ActiveDir-owner@mail.activedir.org] On Behalf Of joe
Sent: Wednesday, October 22, 2008 8:39 AM
To: ActiveDir@mail.activedir.org
Subject: RE: [ActiveDir] DCs on Server Core
I don't think the setup overhead should be a major concern, deployment is
such a small piece of the puzzle. Just think of the overhead you will save
on patching time. How many patches have come out now that said "Does not
apply to Windows Server Core"? Plus once you get the deployment script down,
should be a pretty easy cookie cutter. If you are doing it manually, you
probably aren't large enough to justify using server core anyway. Server
core, IMO, will be more for the medium to large orgs that have more skilled
admins who won't be afraid of the dark black CMD prompt staring at them.
Once you are big enough to start truly distinguishing between branch site
and hub site, you are likely big enough for server core AND you are big
enough to be automating your builds and getting admins who have a clue or
the ability to learn a clue on how to manage outside of the point and click
paradigm.
The lack of .NET and Powershell I see as a non-issue both because I dislike
them and because you can still use most of that stuff remotely if truly
needed. I do see the lack of .NET as a stopper for heavy WEB Server
utilization of Server Core though which is a bit sad as I think that is a
good role for server core.
I really see virtualized Server Core RODCs hitting branch sites. Server Core
Full DCs in hub sites. Makes the whole domain overall more secure as you
have less attack vectors sitting on your DCs and sort of forces a slightly
higher skill level for managing them.
joe
--
O'Reilly Active Directory Third Edition -
http://www.joeware.net/win/ad3e.htm
_____
From: ActiveDir-owner@mail.activedir.org
[mailto:ActiveDir-owner@mail.activedir.org] On Behalf Of Tony Murray
Sent: Tuesday, October 21, 2008 5:11 PM
To: ActiveDir@mail.activedir.org
Subject: [ActiveDir] DCs on Server Core
Hi all
Just curious to gauge the general feeling about running WS2008 DCs on Server
Core.
Do you consider it a best practice to run all DCs on Server Core, despite
the increased setup overhead? Or are you perhaps reserving Server Core only
for RODCs in branch offices?
Server Core doesn't (yet) support the .Net Framework (and hence Powershell),
but does is this causing anyone any real pain? There are workarounds after
all.
Tony
| | | |
| GuidoG
Posts:100
| | 10/23/2008 12:58 PM |
| Server Core could become the standard and the UI a "feature" - who knows. I think that would be cool - right now it's either core or full.
The reason for maintaining "one or two of the RWDCs on Full Server" in the Data Centres is that of the learning curve of the operators - basically the "just to make sure" factor. Once delivery processes have been aligned and proven to work with a pure SC installation, we may replace the few Full Servers with Server Core as well.
/Guido
From: ActiveDir-owner@mail.activedir.org [mailto:ActiveDir-owner@mail.activedir.org] On Behalf Of Tony Murray
Sent: Wednesday, October 22, 2008 9:53 PM
To: ActiveDir@mail.activedir.org
Subject: RE: [ActiveDir] DCs on Server Core
Good info guys, thanks.
I guess where I am coming from on this is to see if there are any compelling arguments against the use of Server Core for DCs. So far I haven't heard any, but I'm still seeing a fair few organisations choosing the full version as part of their design. I guess it's just a step too far out of the comfort zone for some.
Personally, I see Server Core as the future of the Windows Server platform. I wouldn't be surprised if we see Windows become Server Core-only some time in the next 10 years. I think we'll start to see a lot of virtualised Server Core instances performing specific roles on shared hardware. So for those small shops still loving the UI, the writing is on the wall.
Microsoft does need to sort out the .NET angle though - make it modular to allow local Server Core support.
Guido, I'm curious as to what reasons you have for maintaining "one or two of the RWDCs" in the Data Centres?
Tony
From: ActiveDir-owner@mail.activedir.org [mailto:ActiveDir-owner@mail.activedir.org] On Behalf Of Grillenmeier, Guido
Sent: Wednesday, 22 October 2008 8:23 p.m.
To: ActiveDir@mail.activedir.org
Subject: RE: [ActiveDir] DCs on Server Core
Fully second joe's thoughts here. I'm in the midst of planning a large Win2008 upgrade for a customer - will take a while until the various aspects of the planning is done, but implementation will start early next year. Server Core x64 definitely platform of choice, though we'll likely still have one or two of the RWDCs per domain running on Full Server in the Data Centers.
Unlike joe I do miss PowerShell on Server Core, but we can live without it as it's not problem to use remotely. But I'm still hoping MSFT will be able to sufficiently progress on Win2008 R2 to only get those parts of the .NET framework on Core that allows it to run PowerShell locally.
/Guido
From: ActiveDir-owner@mail.activedir.org [mailto:ActiveDir-owner@mail.activedir.org] On Behalf Of joe
Sent: Wednesday, October 22, 2008 8:39 AM
To: ActiveDir@mail.activedir.org
Subject: RE: [ActiveDir] DCs on Server Core
I don't think the setup overhead should be a major concern, deployment is such a small piece of the puzzle. Just think of the overhead you will save on patching time. How many patches have come out now that said "Does not apply to Windows Server Core"? Plus once you get the deployment script down, should be a pretty easy cookie cutter. If you are doing it manually, you probably aren't large enough to justify using server core anyway. Server core, IMO, will be more for the medium to large orgs that have more skilled admins who won't be afraid of the dark black CMD prompt staring at them. Once you are big enough to start truly distinguishing between branch site and hub site, you are likely big enough for server core AND you are big enough to be automating your builds and getting admins who have a clue or the ability to learn a clue on how to manage outside of the point and click paradigm.
The lack of .NET and Powershell I see as a non-issue both because I dislike them and because you can still use most of that stuff remotely if truly needed. I do see the lack of .NET as a stopper for heavy WEB Server utilization of Server Core though which is a bit sad as I think that is a good role for server core.
I really see virtualized Server Core RODCs hitting branch sites. Server Core Full DCs in hub sites. Makes the whole domain overall more secure as you have less attack vectors sitting on your DCs and sort of forces a slightly higher skill level for managing them.
joe
--
O'Reilly Active Directory Third Edition - http://www.joeware.net/win/ad3e.htm
________________________________
From: ActiveDir-owner@mail.activedir.org [mailto:ActiveDir-owner@mail.activedir.org] On Behalf Of Tony Murray
Sent: Tuesday, October 21, 2008 5:11 PM
To: ActiveDir@mail.activedir.org
Subject: [ActiveDir] DCs on Server Core
Hi all
Just curious to gauge the general feeling about running WS2008 DCs on Server Core.
Do you consider it a best practice to run all DCs on Server Core, despite the increased setup overhead? Or are you perhaps reserving Server Core only for RODCs in branch offices?
Server Core doesn't (yet) support the .Net Framework (and hence Powershell), but does is this causing anyone any real pain? There are workarounds after all.
Tony
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